How to Be a Great Podcast Guest with Paige Velasquez Budde

Full video transcript

What’s up, what’s up, Jarvis Nation, Darby here, and I’m joined today by Paige Velasquez Budde. Paige is a partner and CEO at Zilker Media, an Austin-based agency building people-driven brands. During her tenure as CEO, Zilker Media has been named one of the fastest growing companies in Austin and one of the best places to work for two years in a row by the Austin Business Journal, and has been listed among Austin Inno’s coolest companies. She’s been featured as a speaker on digital marketing strategy inside workshops at national venues such as Harvard Medical School, and for organizations such as Gladiator, IBPA, and the Women’s President Organization. She has led marketing campaigns and strategies for some of the world’s most recognized authorities, including New York Times bestseller and Fortune magazine senior editor at large Geoff Colvin, and New York Times and Wall Street Journal bestseller and Hall of Fame speaker Sally Hogshead, and many others. Paige has also counseled leading international brands such as Russell Stover and A2 Milk. Her approach to people-driven marketing has been featured in many media outlets including Inc, Thrive Global, Texas CEO Magazine, Authority Magazine, Business News Daily, and Business.com.

Paige, you’ve got quite the list of accolades. I am tongue-tied right now. Thank you so much for taking the time and coming and sharing with us how to be an awesome guest on podcasts. We have a lot of authors in our community here at Jarvis Underground, a lot of people using books as lead magnets to generate more business, to get in front of more stages, and to increase the impact they have in the world, so I’m stoked to be here and learn from you. Thank you so much for taking the time, welcome Paige.

Thank you so much for having me, Darby. I’m such a fan of you, and extremely fascinated by what you guys do and the innovation you’re bringing to the publishing industry, so I’m just really excited to dive in. This is going to just cover one side of the PR component for authors, which is podcast interviews, and really the reason I’m so passionate about this topic is that for over a decade our team at Zilker Media has had the honor of doing end-to-end branding for some of the world’s top executives, thought leaders, companies, and authors, so it’s been incredible to see how much that landscape has shifted over time in terms of what’s providing the most value for authors in a PR or marketing strategy.

Over the next hour or so I want to cover as much ground as possible. In the first portion of the conversation I’m going to discuss where podcasts fit in today’s landscape and the changing world of PR. In the second half I’m going to get more practical on how to pitch podcasts to secure a guest spot, because I didn’t want to leave that out since it’s such an integral part of the process. Some people might say it’s great once you land an interview, but how do you even get there? So I’ll cover that too, and then talk through how to prepare and deliver an interview that makes an audience want to go visit your website, buy your book, or hire you for whatever service you offer. So we’re going to touch on all three of those things today.

I am stoked and ready to learn from one of the masters on this subject. Everyone watching live today, thank you so much for being here. This will be recorded and a replay will be available. If you’re watching live, go ahead and say hey in the comments, and as questions come up, feel free to drop them in there; we’ve reserved time at the end of the hour so Paige or I can help answer them.

Before we dive into everything podcast related, I wanted to take a step back first and talk about the media landscape and where PR and the podcast guest strategy fit in. Several years back, if you wanted to get a message out at scale there were really only two ways: rent or buy coverage in an ad, magazine, or billboard, or get interviewed and earn your way onto a media outlet. Today things are vastly different. We still have rented media and earned media, but the biggest game changer and opportunity for leverage moving forward is the growth of what we call owned media. I want to walk through each of these areas so we have a good understanding of where everything fits in the overarching strategy.

First is rented media: all the messages that go out where you fully control the content, but it lives on someone else’s platform, meaning someone else owns the access to that audience. Advertising is the obvious example; you buy an ad, you control its content, but it goes out to an audience someone else owns. Social media also lives here, your Instagram, Facebook, LinkedIn, Twitter. Some people say they get why advertising is rented but not social media, since those are their own friends and connections. We learned the hard way that this is rented media. We had been working with a client on their Facebook page and grew it from a thousand people to over two million, getting an insane amount of engagement and visibility and revenue from Facebook. Then one day, I believe it was 2013, there was a switch in the algorithm; they shifted from an organic model to a pay-to-play model, and that’s where we started seeing that Facebook truly owns access to your audience, and now makes you pay to access it moving forward. That’s why social media falls in the rented category.

The second category is earned media, which is where we’ll focus primarily today. Earned media is being invited onto someone else’s stage or platform to deliver your message, giving the audience the impression you’ve earned that opportunity. This includes speaking engagements, PR, awards, and client referrals. Because this category does more for credentialing, most authors lean toward putting all their eggs in the earned media basket. But if your only focus is garnering earned media, the limiting factor is you don’t have direct control over whether your message goes out; you have indirect control in that you can write a really good book or give a good interview, but you have to sit back and hope the interview request comes in because someone else did something. Even though it’s an important part of the strategy, and why we’re focusing here today, it’s not where your marketing should end. Earned media is a very important category early on because of that credibility-building factor, but over time the focus has to shift alongside rented media toward owned media.

Owned media are the assets where you fully own the connection to your audience: your website, email list, blog, and physical mailing list. The key is figuring out how to siphon audiences you’re exposed to through rented and earned media down into your owned media audience, which is the most important thing for long-term success in growing your business, even after book launch. We’ll dive into that more when we get to podcast interview specifics, but I thought it was important to cover first.

One of the biggest shifts we’ve seen in the media landscape is that we as consumers are increasingly moving our attention away from large generic media, for two reasons. One, we’re increasingly projecting bias and filters on what we consume, and two, and more important, when we invest an hour of our time consuming large generic media, we only get a fraction of the value for that time investment. For example, my office is about a thirty-minute commute from Austin, and every morning on my way to work I used to listen to my favorite morning show, the Bobby Bones Show. What I loved is that the hosts didn’t only cover country radio, which is what they were on air for; they also brought in the songwriters behind the songs and had them tell their stories. During that show they focused a lot on that, and I thought it was such a unique thing about them. Most mornings I’d invest thirty or forty minutes to get one ten-minute segment on the songwriters, so I started switching over from my radio and plugging in my phone to listen to the Bobbycast, hosted by Bobby Bones, which was an hour of content all from his favorite songwriters. Now I’ve started doing the same thing for leadership and marketing content when I consume media.

Now that we understand where podcasts fall in the landscape and the strategy, how do you actually get that interview? Some of you might be thinking it’s great to learn how to be a great podcast guest, but how do you even get on a show to begin with? On this slide is a formula you can use to craft your email outreach or pitch to a podcast you’d like to be featured on. If you’re taking notes, feel free to screenshot this; I’ve also shared these slides with Darby and Zachariah so they’ll share them as well. This is a formula you want to use to pitch yourself to a show. Another thing to think about is who to send it to. Look for a host contact and a producer contact; if a podcast has both listed, pitch the producer first, since they’re more likely to be looking at all the applications and deciding whether it fits the podcast’s long-term strategy or themes. If there’s no producer, the host is the next best person to email. The key to this outreach template is that it’s simple and leads with value.

I want to walk through an example of a podcast pitch from this template brought to life, a live example from an actual pitch our publicity director sent that resulted in an interview for one of our clients’ book launch campaigns. One of the first things she did was lead with the author’s credentials in the subject line, which is key to immediately catching a producer or host’s attention. Producers are typically getting hundreds if not thousands of pitches a day if they have a decent following, so you want to keep the email short and easy to read. Our publicity director bolded key information she thought would stand out most, kept paragraphs concise, and used bullet points to deliver value succinctly. This pitch was less than 250 words, which is incredibly short, but it’s all about keeping it concise, delivering value, and making it an easy format to read. If a host opens an email with five four-sentence paragraphs, they’re going to delete it because they don’t have time to read it. You want to avoid giving a producer or host a reason to delete your email, so keep it clear, value-driven, and researched, understanding what will be most appealing to them in terms of conversation and talking points.

At the end of the pitch, our publicity director used bullet points to clearly lay out potential conversation areas that would create an interesting discussion for that show, customized for each show. We always recommend listening to at least one, if not two, episodes to get a feel for what will be most valuable based on the topics they cover and the host’s interview style. Now I want to touch on what you should absolutely avoid in your pitch, which is just as important as what you should do. You don’t want to come across as overly promotional with a bunch of jargon; that’s the mistake we see most. Watch your language to avoid overused words, and focus on credentialing and delivering value. There’s a list of the most overused words in press releases from 2021 that I find kind of funny.

Now let’s say you’ve sent that pitch and received an email back that you’ve landed the interview. The big question is how do you prepare yourself to be a great podcast guest? There are three areas to focus on: the pre-interview stage, the actual podcast interview, and the post-interview follow-up.

During the pre-interview stage, there are a few things to check off your list. The biggest shift we’ve seen in podcast interviews, especially during and after the pandemic, is to be prepared for video. Many podcasts you might have thought were audio-only have been moving to recording video in addition to audio. Ahead of the interview, ask the host or producer whether the interview will include video recording. Sometimes hosts like to have video on simply so you can look at each other during the conversation; other times podcasters use a portion of the video just for promotional purposes while the main long-form content goes out on audio, and some release the whole video on YouTube and other platforms while stripping the audio for the podcast feed. Always make sure you’re video-ready, with good lighting and an appropriate, not-too-busy background, and avoid sitting directly in front of a window. Explicitly ask the producer ahead of time what to expect, or your face might end up looking surprised on camera. I can speak from personal experience; this happened to me during an interview during COVID when I didn’t quite have my hair and makeup the way I wanted, and that video lives on forever.

Also in the pre-interview stage, many podcast hosts require a 15-to-20-minute pre-interview call. Don’t be afraid of this call; it’s to ensure you and the host have the right chemistry and can establish a relationship before recording. Sometimes it’s general conversation, sometimes they hone in more on the themes you want to cover. This is also a good opportunity to test your equipment if the pre-interview call happens on the same platform they’ll record on. It’s important to invest in a good pair of earphones, like AirPods, or a strong podcast mic if you’re going to be doing a lot of podcasts. Another thing to prepare is getting a sense of the type of questions that will be asked by listening to past interviews; that’s the best way to learn. If you followed the pitching template, you’ve probably already listened to at least one episode to craft that pitch, but it’s great to listen to a few episodes to get a sense of the host’s style and question types, which tend to be pretty similar interview to interview. One big misconception of PR is that you’ll always see the questions ahead of time; some hosts will send them, but that’s the exception, not the rule, since most podcasters want an organic, long-form conversation. You should never ask for the questions if they’re not offered.

The last thing to do ahead of the interview is get a backup number from the host or producer, just in case your dial-in, Zoom, or whatever platform you’re using doesn’t work or the internet goes out mid-interview. It’s also helpful to give them your cell number in case of connection issues, so you can reach each other directly and avoid rescheduling due to tech problems; this happens often, and having a plan B shows you’re a true professional. One thing that’s happened to me is having a pair of headphones die mid-interview, so I try to always keep an extra set I can just plug in, since switching to a computer’s built-in audio diminishes sound quality.

When you get to the interview portion itself, there are only a few things to keep in mind, since you’ve done so much prep ahead of time; this should be the most fun and easy part of the process. Make sure all your apps and phone notifications are shut down, since the last thing a podcast host wants is a notification sound going off during the recording. To help enhance sound quality, put yourself in what we call a soft room, one with carpets, wall decor, or furniture that can absorb sound. Avoid concrete, hard tile, or glass walls, which create an echo. Most podcast interviews range from 30 minutes to an hour, which is long-form content, so you want to keep your energy up throughout. We recommend smiling during the interview even if it’s audio-only, since it impacts your tone and energy; some clients like to stand up if it makes sense, since that helps keep energy up virtually. Whatever you have to do to keep your energy up during that long-form content, make sure you’re doing it.

Now the most important part, the end of the interview. The most important thing is to plan and deliver an interesting call to action. Remember, getting a podcast interview is great, but the long-term value is driving those listeners back to your owned media audience, your website, or getting them to sign up for your email list, so you have the opportunity to nurture them into buying a book, since they’re often not ready for an immediate conversion. At the end of almost every interview, hosts ask where people can go to learn more about you, so instead of just pointing people to your website, social media, or book, point them toward a compelling call to action, like a free downloadable resource or a quiz, giving listeners a reason to visit your site and join your email list to become part of your owned audience.

The call to action seeing a lot of success right now is pointing people toward a quiz on a website, which is interactive content; instead of giving them something you think is valuable, like a free download, you give them something they think is valuable, like free personalized feedback through a quiz or assessment. This idea came to us several years back when we worked on a book with authors Katty Kay and Claire Shipman called The Confidence Code, about closing the confidence gap between men and women in the workplace. The authors wanted to partner with a research firm to create a quiz people could take on their website to determine how confident they were, and then learn what steps they could take to become more confident. The quiz came back at 55 questions, and we worried it was too long, but the authors pushed for it, and we’re glad they did, because over 200,000 people have taken it over the past few years. At the end of every interview, when tossed the softball question of where the audience could go to find more information, instead of saying to go to Amazon to buy the book, they’d say something like: a lot of listeners are curious how confident they are, and we get this question so often that we’ve set up a free confidence quiz on our website. The way you answer that softball question at the end of an interview determines how many people get up and go to your website to learn more and sign up for your email list; they may not be ready to buy your book yet, but they’re interested in something like how confident they are. Once they land on the site and answer the quiz questions, they get a response based on their answers, for example being told they have medium confidence and given five things to focus on over the next 30 days, with a link to download the chapter of the book that deals with that specifically. After they take the quiz, and enter their email to do so, joining your email list, you work them down a funnel toward buying your book, hiring you, or buying your product. The key is finding a way to extend your interaction over time with a much larger group of people rather than trying to cold-sell directly. One of the biggest things to think about is what the right call to action is for your podcast interviews, one that leads people to your website and gives you the opportunity to nurture and teach them, instead of just trying to sell and send them straight to Amazon; your conversion will be extremely higher pointing toward something like a quiz, while still mentioning your book, than with a direct call to action alone.

Once you’ve completed the interview, there’s still very important work to do, since your goal as a guest is to build a long-term, win-win relationship with the podcast producer and host. One of the best things you can do to support a show is leave an Apple Podcasts review, since that boosts the show’s rankings and credibility in Apple’s algorithm; podcast producers and hosts absolutely notice this. Sometimes our team even rates an interview or podcast before we pitch it, because we’ve been listening to it to understand the best approach for outreach; this can happen before you pitch a podcast and also after you’ve been a guest on the show.

You also want to be intentional about how you share your interview once it goes live. I know for some of you it might feel uncomfortable to share your interview on your personal social media channels and might feel overly promotional, but it’s vital and important to the show’s success that you share it with your audience. Our recommendation is to share it twice on social media, tagging the show and the host. One way to do this without feeling overly promotional is to talk about the show and host and how valuable the conversation was for you, if you feel uncomfortable talking about yourself. I also recommend pushing it out to your email list and adding it to your website to maximize reach; this can lead to new listenership for the show and show goodwill toward the host. You never know, down the line they might want to have you back on the show or invite you to become a recurring guest, so think strategically about how you can promote it on your platforms and within your network. It’s also important to stay in touch with the producer or host of the show; sign up for their newsletter or follow them on social media, share their content every once in a while even when it’s not your interview, and comment on what you find valuable from them. You never know where these relationships can lead; a producer might hop over to another show, so focus on cultivating that relationship even outside the interview.

The biggest thing to remember is that getting media exposure through a podcast is an important portion of your PR strategy, especially for having a well-rounded strategy with earned media included, but it’s only a portion, and earned media or PR overall is only a portion of the full marketing strategy. At the end of the day, the goal is to drive these opportunities toward growing your owned audience with the right call to action at the end of the interview, for long-term success.

Paige also shared a new PR subscription offering from Zilker Media, launching before the end of the year, an online program created by their PR team to help authors and thought leaders pitch themselves to high-value podcasts, including two emails a month each featuring five hand-picked podcasts to pitch.

Toward the end of the session, Darby and Paige addressed live audience questions before wrapping up. Darby thanked Paige for a “waterfall of great tips” for anyone getting into podcasting to grow their author platform, or looking to get their existing books featured more. Paige can be reached at Zilker Media, and offered to jump on a call with anyone looking for a sounding board on their PR strategy, closing by saying she appreciated being part of the conversation and being able to share her forward-thinking perspective on publishing and book marketing.